AW: [Int-koordination] [pp-eu.board] [pp-eu] [pp-eu.council] Complaint for the upcoming council meeting of PPEU

[Bastian <bastian AT piratbb.de>]

Hi Muriel!

 

 

 

Von: Muriel
Gesendet: Freitag, 26. Mai 2017 13:36
An: PPEU Board
Cc: PPEU coordination group; Thomas Gaul; Internationale Koordination; Council of the European Pirate Party
Betreff: Re: [Int-koordination] [pp-eu.board] [pp-eu] [pp-eu.council] Complaint for the upcoming council meeting of PPEU

 

Dear Bastian,

The event was set as public. Anyone can register to the system and connect to this link to view what's going on in the meeting:

http://voteit.europeanpirateparty.eu/european-pirates-council-meeting-2017/

This URL is unkown and was not set to public. Public means public, not only public available. It’s the responsibility of the board to care for the statues.

 

Since it's set as a public event, anyone requesting to enter gets automatic permission as a viewer.
 
I tried this two days ago and it was working well, and there are several other observers already, but please let me know if you know of anyone encountering any problem to view the meeting, since this would be an error and not an intended feature.

As you say, the meeting should be public.

Fine.

All non-voting representatives of observer members and non-voting delegates of ordinary members which have been appointed had already been given all appropriate permissions to participate in the Meeting (all except for the "vote" permission). Although in our case this is would not be extremely relevant, because we will not use the "vote" feature of the system, we will vote publicly (stating the vote in the comments) so that the delegates are accountable.

I can’t get an access. I’m login as you can see in your monitoring device. All meetings Ongoing, Upcoming, Closed are shown as Zero.

Regarding the agenda of the meeting, you can find the board's proposal if you clic under the "Agenda" agenda item on the left, within the VoteIt platform.

I can click and see nothing further.

As far as I know, our statutes allow the invitation notification to be sent by email to the members, so that was what we did within the deadline. Later on, we thought it would be good to publish it on the blog as well, to improve its reach, and we did that a few days later. But the Council Meeting anouncement was sent on time. We also sent a second email called "Update on the PIRATES Council Meeting 2017" with some more information, which PPDE should have received, please let me know if this is not the case.

 

Where is your members-list including council members?

 

We had had one: http://ppeu.net/wiki/doku.php?id=ppeu:members

 

Where is the list of accredited members?

In principle the decisions of the Board can be found on the board's minutes, located on their majority at ppeu.piratenpad.de (a few exceptions elsewhere, but in those cases I tried to link them so they can all be found).

 

The pads are all non-public.

Thank you for your feedback!

 

Thank you for paying attention to my comments.

 

Greetings,

 

         Muriel

 

Cheers

Bastian

 

2017-05-26 12:31 GMT+02:00 Bastian <bastian AT piratbb.de>:

Good Morning,

 

may I ask for an official agenda and monitoring pages of this hidden event?

 

Due to Article 14 (2):

 

“Council meetings are normally open to the public unless the Council itself decides otherwise for all or part of its proceedings. This shall be the exception and may only be decided for reasons of protecting the data of an

individual or for similar concerns.”

 

Article 14 (3) “Non-voting representatives of Observer members and Non-Voting-Delegates from Ordinary Members, and Members of the Board may participate as well.”

 

Where can I find the decision, that the council-meeting is non-public to be held on a hidden platform?

 

There is only ONE official notice on the blog, where can I find all necessary decisions made by the board?

 

https://europeanpirateparty.eu/invitation-to-the-european-pirate-party-first-council-meeting-of-2017/ (2.5.2017)

 

Article 14 (7): “A link to a website with the agenda in the invitation shall be sufficient and necessary.”

 

Btw: This public was outdated due to Article 14 (7):”… invite all members by email at least one month before the date of the Council meeting…”

 

Best regards.

 

Bastian

Coordinator PPDE  for Incorporation PPEU

 

Von: pp-eu [mailto:pp-eu-bounces AT lists.pp-international.net] Im Auftrag von Muriel Rovira Esteva
Gesendet: Freitag, 26. Mai 2017 01:14
An: Thomas Gaul
Cc: Internationale Koordination; PPEU Board; PPEU coordination group; Council of the European Pirate Party

Betreff: Re: [pp-eu] [pp-eu.council] [Int-koordination] [pp-eu.board] Complaint for the upcoming council meeting of PPEU

 

Dear Thomas,

There is a list of the delegates under the "Quorum" agenda item on VoteIT. The particular email addresses provided by the delegates are not there, because in some cases they are personal emails.

It would be nice to recommend the delegates or another representative from the parties to register to the mailing lists, but I'm afraid we cannot force them to do so against their will, specially since there are many lists and I'm not even sure the Council decided on any particular one being an official channel. Maybe that would be something that could be proposed and decided on the Council Meeting.

 

As you know, you can spend months trying to have the updated contacts of the members, and still find out after all this time that there's nobody at the other side. I guess we all agree that it's a responsibility of the member to ensure its contact details are updated if they change them, but of course, we try our best nonetheless.

 

Greetings,

 

         Muriel

 

 

2017-05-26 0:45 GMT+02:00 Thomas Gaul <thomas.gaul AT pp-international.net>:

Dear Muriel,

 

If you say so, I will follow your advice.

 

The proposal will be presented to the Council in time, using Vote-IT.

 

And on another issue, which parties are “accredited” atm. Think that might be of interest as these mailing-lists we write to deem to have all delegates on it. If not, the board should have addressed the admins for it to just add those who are new etc.

 

Enjoy the night until the meeting will start.

 

And I would even recommend to send an additional email to board’s channels with all the changes being around and all the hints you can give.

 

Best regards

 

Thomas

 

Von: Muriel Rovira Esteva [mailto:muriel AT pirata.cat]
Gesendet: Freitag, 26. Mai 2017 00:39
An: Thomas Gaul <thomas.gaul AT pp-international.net>
Cc: PPEU coordination group <pp-eu AT lists.pp-international.net>; Muriel Rovira Esteva <muriel AT pirata.cat>; PPEU Board <pp-eu.board AT lists.pp-international.net>; Internationale Koordination <int-koordination AT lists.piratenpartei.de>; Council of the European Pirate Party <pp-eu.council AT lists.pp-international.net>
Betreff: Re: [pp-eu] [pp-eu.council] [Int-koordination] [pp-eu.board] Complaint for the upcoming council meeting of PPEU

 

Dear Thomas,

I think that it's better (for transparency and for record keeping) that the proposals coming from a member are put forward by their delegates and not the Board.

I'm afraid many registered delegates are not on any of these mailing lists, so they may not be able to follow what's going on. Therefore, it's better if all the formal discussions and proposals take place on the VoteIT meeting and not on other channels.

Greetings,

          Muriel

 

 

2017-05-26 0:04 GMT+02:00 Thomas Gaul <thomas.gaul AT pp-international.net>:

Dear Muriel,

thank you for this.

As for "the additional round" the previous email had been an official
motion to the PPEU-Council on behalf of the PPDE delegaates, despite the
wording.

If there is the need for PPDE to do it within the tool "Vote-IT" and you
say so we will do so.

Thank you for your efforts.

Best regards

Thomas

Am 25.05.2017 um 23:58 schrieb Muriel Rovira Esteva:
> Dear Thomas,
>
> Thank you for your suggestion. The system has already a built in Support
> contact form, so I've added my email to it in order to receive any messages
> sent there, and I also added a small note in the welcome page so that
> people will see it even if they can't register. I've tried it and it worked
> well, please let me know if you run into any problem with it.
>
> Regarding the election of a new board, right now the agenda item is there
> for formal reasons, but of course it's useless because we didn't receive
> any nomination on time. According to our statutes, in order to be able to
> nominate candidates "(7) The Council may decide on additional rounds of
> voting and the admission of new candidates, if a position could not be
> filled."
>
> It is my understanding and suggestion that, as soon as we have carried out
> the basic procedural decisions (chairs, agenda, quorum), that we should
> propose to the Council to approve an additional round of admission of
> candidates. This can be proposed under the agenda item "Other motions", if
> you want, or under "Election of the new board". It would be great if PPDE
> makes that motion so that the Council can decide on it.
>
> Greetings,
>
>          Muriel
>
>
> 2017-05-25 22:41 GMT+02:00 Thomas Gaul <thomas.gaul AT piratenpartei.de>:
>
>> Dear Muriel,
>>
>>
>>
>> thank you for this. Please add an email address plus text for the public
>> on the main page so if they are interested to follow the meeting have a
>> possibility to contact you (or others) for adding them in if they have
>> problems.
>>
>>
>>
>> Another issue.
>>
>>
>>
>> I am now in the system. But I miss the opportunity for the council to
>> “reopen the call for candidates” as the council has to decide on it,
>> according to the statutes.
>>
>>
>>
>> That very decision has to be on there somewhere. If not this will be the
>> request to add this as a motion on behalf of PPDE to the PPEU-Council.
>>
>>
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>>
>>
>> Thomas
>>
>>
>>

>> *Von:* pp-eu [mailto:pp-eu-bounces AT lists.pp-international.net] *Im
>> Auftrag von *Muriel Rovira Esteva
>> *Gesendet:* Donnerstag, 25. Mai 2017 22:15
>> *An:* Council of the European Pirate Party <pp-eu.council AT lists.pp-
>> international.net>
>> *Cc:* EU Election coordination group <pp-eu AT lists.pp-international.net>;
>> PPEU Board <pp-eu.board AT lists.pp-international.net>; Internationale
>> Koordination <int-koordination AT lists.piratenpartei.de>
>> *Betreff:* Re: [pp-eu] [pp-eu.council] [Int-koordination] [pp-eu.board]

>> Complaint for the upcoming council meeting of PPEU
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> I am creating now the users "by hand", you should receive an email from me
>> in a few minutes.
>>
>> Greetings,
>>
>>            Muriel
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 2017-05-25 21:20 GMT+02:00 Thomas Gaul <thomas.gaul AT piratenpartei.de>:
>>
>> Hello Tony,
>>
>> thanks for you efforts. I did not receive any mail from the system. (spam
>> folder is empty as well)
>>
>> I was using this email address.
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>> Thomas
>>
>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>> Von: int-koordination-request AT lists.piratenpartei.de [mailto:
>> int-koordination-request AT lists.piratenpartei.de] Im Auftrag von Tony
>> Motakis (tvelocity AT gmail.com via int-koordination Mailing List)
>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mai 2017 17:50
>> An: pp-eu.board AT lists.pp-international.net
>> Cc: Council of the European Pirate Party <pp-eu.council AT lists.pp-
>> international.net>; EU Election coordination group <
>> pp-eu AT lists.pp-international.net>; Internationale Koordination <
>> int-koordination AT lists.piratenpartei.de>
>> Betreff: Re: [Int-koordination] [pp-eu.board] Complaint for the upcoming
>> council meeting of PPEU
>>
>> Hello Thomas,
>>
>> Can you confirm whether you got an invitation email in the last minutes?
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Tony
>>
>> On Thu, May 25, 2017 at 12:07 PM, Tony Motakis <tvelocity AT gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> Hello Thomas,
>>>
>>> With which email address(es) have you tried to register? I don't see a
>>> registered user with your name/email.
>>>
>>> Are you using the register link here?
>>> http://voteit.europeanpirateparty.eu/register
>>>
>>> Please also check your spam folder, while I investigate things from
>>> our side for possible causes. If you checked yesterday, please check
>>> again, there might have been a delay.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> Tony
>>>
>>> 2017-05-24 23:18 GMT+02:00 Thomas Gaul <thomas.gaul AT piratenpartei.de>:
>>
>>>> Dear board of PPEU!
>>>>
>>>> I made several attempts to sign in with the official Vote-IT via
>>>> http://voteit.europeanpirateparty.eu/.
>>>>
>>>> As for now I have not received any response from that very system. So
>>>> no sign in had been possible.
>>>>
>>>> I had made several attempts with even different email addresses.
>>>>
>>>> The board should assure that the participation in the Council Meeting
>>>> is assured for those being officially part of it.
>>>>
>>>> Additionally, as assured by the statutes the meeting shall be open to
>>>> the public. As for the Vote-It tool I have found no way as to really
>>>> assure the public can participate.
>>>>
>>>> As the assumed start (25.05.2017 00:00 CEST) is coming close I expect
>>>> the board to act very quickly.
>>>>
>>>> And for another thing, on the Vote-IT tool is mentionend a "how to"
>>>> <https://prezi.com/mwgmftmou_qn/present/?auth_key=5hjiaos&
>> follow=hoch1kcutd31&kw=present-mwgmftmou_qn&rc=ref-80413>.
>>>> This introduction is no longer available.
>>>>
>>>> Please help out a.s.a.p.
>>>>
>>>> All delegates and the public should be able to participate. Please
>>>> take care of it.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for your efforts.
>>>>
>>>> Best regards
>>>>
>>>> Thomas Gaul
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Delegate to the PPPEU-Council for the Pirate Party of Germany
>>>>
>>>> Pflugstraße 9a, D-10115 Berlin, Germany
>>>>
>>>> Vorstand: Patrick Schiffer (Vorsitzender), Carsten Sawosch
>>>> (Stellvertretender Vorsitzender), Lothar Krauß (Schatzmeister),
>>>> Kristos Thingilouthis (Politischer Geschäftsführer), Steffen Heuer
>>>> (Stellvertretender Schatzmeister), Thomas Knoblich (Stellvertretender
>>>> Generalsekretär), Alexander Niedermeier (Stellvertretender
>>>> politischer
>>>> Geschäftsführer)
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> pp-eu.board mailing list
>>>> pp-eu.board AT lists.pp-international.net
>>>> http://lists.pp-international.net/listinfo/pp-eu.board
>>
>> --
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>> The list homepage: https://lists.piratenpartei.
>> de/sympa/info/int-koordination
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> pp-eu.council AT lists.pp-international.net
>> http://lists.pp-international.net/listinfo/pp-eu.council
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> pp-eu AT lists.pp-international.net
>> http://lists.pp-international.net/listinfo/pp-eu
>>
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> pp-eu mailing list
> pp-eu AT lists.pp-international.net
> http://lists.pp-international.net/listinfo/pp-eu
>

--
Thomas Gaul
Pirate Parties International (PPI)
- General Secretary -

Board: Guillaume Saouli (Chairman), Bailey Lamon (Vice-Chairwoman),
Thomas Gaul (General Secretary), Keith L. Goldstein (Treasurer), Raymond
Johnson, Andrew Reitemeyer, Koen de Voegt (Board Members)

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